Damn you @HOUSEBOAT_THANGS
You promised if the game ever died, paying members could have the game. While I consider Proteus an improvement/upgrade, it has been running parallel to Triton and doesn’t seem like it will replace it soon. There is also plenty of love for Triton, enough so that changing the game then one day releasing the code to something vastly different than what someone signed up for, would be extremely disappointing. Would you consider hosting the game on a player paid/hosted server to retain the code so if one day you did give it out, we could keep both Triton and Proteus?
The plan is for Triton to always be playable, even if you have to create the Triton games yourself.
If there ever comes a time when I decide I cant afford the few hundred dollars a month it costs to host the game I will make it open-source and you will be able to host it yourself.
I still prefer Triton and would like the triton 64 game back in action. That being said I think a prot 64 could be fun as well. My big disappointment with prot is the warp gates being unusable at an early level and the fact the games kind of drag on due to the fact that stars lose their infrastructure when captured.
Specifically created an account on here to put my voice across on this: classic 64-player games NEED to come back.
They were the most popular (as far as I could tell) and the USP about this game. I paid 30-odd quid (if I remember right) for a lifetime account a few years ago specifically because of classic 64 – several months later and they were nowhere to be found! I immediately dropped off once I saw that and since then simply casually check every 3-4 months to see if they’re back.
There was a vast cast of regulars who you got to know over multiple games. There was so much drama back and forth in each game, it was awesome. You had to really be strategic and a bit mathy. I actually learned to become more cutthroat and calculating in real-life in part because of this game at that time in my life – it paid off quite well in much healthier salaries and financial opportunities along with all the other benefits and lifestyle changes that brings…
To be very clear: there’s no real reason to play NP2 if there’s no 64-player. It was a surprisingly deep game at that level but outside 64-player it was just dry and boring. I think a lot of people just dropped off once they were gone. It’s the major leagues, you know – ain’t nobody got time for local games when the Lakers or the Raiders are in town!
P.S. Smulm, you should really add BOsshOg, Coenna and HOUSEBOAT_THANGS, GOON along with myself to your original post.
I think there are some studies out there that can be found on the Internet, that demonstrate these mental skills improvement effects. Some good life lessons can be learned from games and proper entertainment.
@MurasakiNoKaze , should I count your vote ?
Take my VOTE !
I vote YES !
Loved the NP2 64 so much.
PS. on Proteus : I quite strongly dislike wormholes making the action messy to my liking. A 64p game with wormholes? Oh boy, that might be a gigantic mess. Without them, it would probably be good though. Just my opinion. Maybe some of you guys like these wormholes ?
Also, I much prefer how warp gates work in NP2.
And the +1 defense bonus too, that made early game’s fights so tense.
I really like the proteus warp gate method personally. It really encourages pushing hyperspace up to higher levels rather than just leveling up to 6-7 and then largely forgetting about it. More techs with late game value at higher levels is definitely a good thing.
Also enemies can’t use them against you up close to launch lightning fast attacks like in standard NP2.
That would be a yes
It’s funny MurasakiNoKaze is complaining about why I don’t want to discuss Proteus on a thread where it is not a topic of discussion. Also, I was one of the ORIGINAL beta testers for Proteus and in fact several of its key features were my ideas, such as Scanning adding to research. And I’m pretty several other things got mentioned as well. So yes, I have been around Proteus A LOT more than at least some, and had real input.
And I still hate it. There is nothing I like about it. I apologize to everyone, because honestly I didn’t intend to come back after this seeing as Jay’s mind is clearly made up. I’ve learnt my lesson from trying to get the old NP avatars back. When he says eventually it means never. And that’s fine. His game, his rules, even if I don’t like the changes made. But I ended up seeing the replies in my inbox, so… I’ll just let this be it for now.
In regards to Proteus, I don’t list anything because it would be FASTER to list what I actually LIKE about it. See below for the loooong rant of what I don’t:
1: it is not enjoyable to have carrier price stack like it does. Not only is that the farthest thing from how industry actually works, but it is annoying as I’ll get out. I would not play for that reason alone. The carriers should just be more expensive or something, honestly.
2. Last I checked, there was a change to this, but back in the original Proteus, weapons benefits to defenders was overwhelming. Offensives were too difficult. Whoever won a star usually never lost it if they were smart. So it favored lucky aggressors FAR more than defenders. I play aggressively. It’s good strategy and so the game ruled out my entire reason to play by this concept alone. Thankfully I think it’s gone, but the damage is still done from the expensive carrier issue.
3: Star experience. I think this is a thing and actually makes conquering a star harder. This too, may have been something I vouched for or even requested. And it was a stupid thing if so, because it does not work well. It makes conquering stars even harder.
4: Tech pricing… Thank GOD for the ledger. Because I cannot make heads or tales of the price scaling and it just makes trading awkward as can be.
5: Alliances. For some reason I’ve never had good interactions with other players in the game. It is usually more ruthless in a lonely way. That is not good at all. Diplomacy should be important.
6: It’s uglier. Screw cell phones. I hate them as it is and they suck up too much time. Really are “Cell” phones, mental prisons. Catering to that crowd is a smart business move on Jay’s part, but the current Proteus is down right hideous to look at. I still remember fondly the gorgeous interface of the original Neptune’s Pride. Triton is cuter, but at least it isn’t bland.
7: Game mechanics. Nothing about them works for me. It is like a 4x speed game on steroids. Back in the old days, when I was more free and could literally sit there all day with nothing better to do, sure, that might work. But with how Proteus is now… I still can’t comprehend how to enjoy something that requires constant attention and careful resource micromanagement. A beauty of NP2 is that I need not log on continuously during early to mid stages of the game. Proteus’ mechanics in this regard are all over the place for me. This is more a personal gripe though. I honestly don’t think it is a genuine flaw…
8: The tech, though, IS a flaw. It renders falling behind in tech a brutal and pointless waste in futility. Might as well quit at once, as far as I’ve seen.
9: wormholes. The idea is awesome. And I may even have been instrumental in suggesting that idea too. They seemed to smart. And yet they are implemented terribly. I know what Jay’s going for, but to me, there is no reason to spend 24 hours moving somewhere unless it is to set up a Scanning Outpost at an ally’s system. It links the galaxy, but it ruins it because you can see other players moving back and forth and that in turn removes some of the secrecy, certainly lets you know when enemies are moving large quantities of ships. It is also slow… way too slow. If that’s changed by now since I last played, then good, because it was awful otherwise.
10: Warp gates: again, useless. Suddenly, despite needing to get on constantly for the hourly income, warp gates do not work as they did in NP2. It seems to me we might as well have none of them at all. They just weren’t worth it anymore, being too expensive and granting a very marginal boost most of the time. They did not even work with wormholes.
11: Carriers get experience but last I heard that doesn’t do anything. Why? Stars seem to gain experience or did during the beta test I played (I think. I don’t pretend to be the brightest star out there, so it wouldn’t surprise me if I got confused on this point). Point being though, considering carriers are at a premium, it would have been more sensible if their experience did something. But then considering what happened with the stars getting it, I would think this is a bad idea all around, too.
12: No terraforming. Jay prefers this, and I have to agree, so this is not a complain per se… yet even so, I’ve noticed empires that don’t grow fast in Proteus die a swift death. So there needs to be SOMETHING done.
Honestly, the issues we set down to solve, Jay, way back when you asked for input on Proteus, are not resolved. It is fun for you and its fans, and that’s fine. But so far NP2 is still not replaced and it would be nice to have the prime game map of NP2, the 64 grand tournaments, return. Or at least the Epic Galaxies, which were also pretty awesome in their own right.
So yeah, I also likely won’t be updating the names at the top of the thread. Jay can surely see activity here and if he bothers to look he’ll see the support. Whether he will bother at all with restoring the 64s has little or nothing to do with signatures, imo. But we’ll see.
On a last note for Proteus, I liked the larger random stars, go a 100 during the beta test, and the ledger. That is it.
Not sure why you felt the need to reply to me specifically instead of just posting but if you’d like my thoughts on your post, then here you are:
It’s funny MurasakiNoKaze is complaining about why I don’t want to discuss Proteus on a thread where it is not a topic of discussion.
I wasn’t so much complaining as pointing out the discourtesy, and spelling it out for you. It has never bothered me what anyone chooses to do online, but I do have an annoying habit of pointing out things that I think are incorrect.
You were asked a question (whether off-topic or not) by the guy who owns the game and this forum.
Whether you believe in his intent or not, the proper thing to do is answer the question with something constructive.
I have been around Proteus A LOT more than at least some, and had real input.
In the beginning, sure, yet now you were seeming to refuse to provide input and even consider Proteus. Glad to see that might not exactly be the case.
And I still hate it. There is nothing I like about it.
On a last note for Proteus, I liked the larger random stars, go a 100 during the beta test, and the ledger. That is it.
Not quite nothing, but close enough I guess.
I apologize to everyone, because honestly I didn’t intend to come back after this seeing as Jay’s mind is clearly made up. I’ve learnt my lesson from trying to get the old NP avatars back. When he says eventually it means never. And that’s fine. His game, his rules, even if I don’t like the changes made. But I ended up seeing the replies in my inbox, so… I’ll just let this be it for now.
Returning is never a problem, it’s how you do it that matters. When returning, don’t do it with a chip on your shoulder, just with the intent to reply and try to remain on-topic if possible. That’s all most moderators and members would want. You did raise some points I think merit discussion so I started this thread.
All that being said, I did see a post by Jay replying to a message about 64 player games positively:
That sounds like not keeping them up all the time, but rather just opening them up once every few months. The games take weeks to start so I think just leaving them open should be fine. The last time I played a 64 player game I waited almost a month for the 64th player to join. If this is too often, maybe once the game starts, show a countdown for when the next one will be available or a message with the date for when the next one is available, but if you’re keeping them, I think it’d help to at least make them visible. Think of it as the business hours most places display on a windows in the storefront. If you show up and that’s not there, you find the doors are locked and lights seem to off, you have no idea what’s going on. A sign with the hours or an “out to lunch” message goes a long way in providing some peace of mind to the customers who might panic and think the business is closing up shop or just have no idea what could be happening.
Setting a 64-player game section under the current 32 will let people know something is going one. Setting a message there will let them know what that is. Personally I think a generic message and a link to the forum topic covering the plans would be great.
Is there anyone who wouldn’t want 64 back?
My vote is : yes
This is a good point.
Honestly it’s either “yes, bring them back” or “meh, I don’t play them, I’ll just ignore them”.
I doubt anyone besides Jay (who’s wallet is the biggest victim here) would have a decent argument for not bringing them back.
Hey there @Smulm.
I’ve been absent from the game for 2y.
But remember have played one of those and was epic (at least the few cycles I’ve survived were enjoyable ).
I don’t know if could have time these days to play a game which is not turn based.
But add my name to the list of old Triton rebels.
Just played and won my first game in several months. It was a 32 player. In my opinion the game was way too easy. Once I got a small lead at the start (40 stars vs 32 stars) there was nothing to be done to stop me, short of my ally betraying me. The circular map made it impossible for other players to coordinate against me and I took them out one by one. By the time I reached 100 of the 320 stars needed for victory the game was essentially over. In the old 64 players I remember victory was never a sure thing until the end of the game, there were several strong players across the map. Made things much more exciting honestly.
Just my thoughts, it’s possible that my game wasn’t normal and most of the 32 player games are more competitive. Would love to have a 64 player game every now and then, even if it isn’t a regular thing!
The circular map is really a simpler two neighbors map.
IMO the circular two neighbors 8 player map should be the New Player’s game.
@TheLastHero , counting your vote.
Hope I’m not late. YES please!!!
I remember my first 64, it was so different from anything else I’ve tried before. Became addicted instantly, and ever since it kept surprising me, because no matter how experienced you were, the moment you felt you’ve got it under control, at next tick there was a surprise waiting… 64 players create complexity, 64 different minds, like really random generators - with outcome you can’t predict. You could only use your intuition, to get what was more or less likely to happen.
32 game at it’s best has just half of that power.
So of course, bring 64 back… and maybe think about creating 128
TheLastHero brought up a good point about it essentially being a 2 neighbor map. At most you’ll have about 4. With the 64 player clover map I felt a little more paranoid. Even though I never fully trust my allies, it’s a lot easier to trust 3 people than 6.
I really liked the 64 player, and felt a great sense of accomplishment from wins, but if we must keep the 32 I think it needs a little more danger.
128p! A splendid idea… 32p is like levelling the top of Everest so that it’s hall height and pretending that climbing mini-Everest is the same thing.