Agree 100% with @HULK on this one. If experiments hits a locked tech, just roll the dice again(lazy but easy way to code it lol).
Actually, I said “Personally, I like it the way it is - sometimes Dr. Banner is a doofus in the lab and develops a tech not advanceable”
So I’d leave it as-is … as frustrating as that can be … and rest assured when this happens (especially when multiple times!), the HULK goes on a rampage and SMASHES Dr. Banner’s test tubes!
I then did go on to say that "If you want to have a way of disabling experimentation, allow setting the starting value to ZERO!"
Also see the referenced forum thread where I actually propose that you should be able to set other techs to ZERO - Weapons and Range would be the two exceptions since you would have difficultly playing a game with those at zero.
well I did misunderstand you then @HULK . sorry. I disagree with this then, I am not a huge fan of luck to begin with, having something you invest in produce nothing swings the game too much. Most of the time in a larger game no big deal, but in the beginning playing others are cutthroat it could mean the game and that is a lame way to lose imo.
FYI that I’m starting to agree with @nick.muzzio …
Of course, I could just be doing a “wah-wah” since in my current 1v1 game, I just spent the effort to finish E2 … and got a (locked) Weapons hit - GRRRRR!
I don’t think it is as much of an issue in large multi-player games, but it is especially unfair in a 1v1 game where the only Tech you are getting it from what you are developing.
So yea, I would suggest that Jay make a change in the code such that when Experimentation awards points, it MUST go to a non-locked tech.
Yea, I thought you might like that @nick.muzzio
I have actually been coming around to your thinking … and especially given that there are not too many many cycles in the 1v1 games, it is a bit unfair if you get absolutely nothing for Exp, especially early on.
OK, you guys convinced me. I should be able to do it soon!
What do you think of the level 0 tech starts? Primarily to disable Banking and Experimentation in custom games.
I’ve run some tests. Setting Banking or Experimentation to 0 breaks production. Setting Weapons to 0 breaks battles. Both causing server side errors. The other techs work.
hah, yeah, I could have told you they would be broken
Thanks Jay … and please make the changes to retro-active so that the 144 points I got for (locked) weapons last cycle in my 1v1 game against @AnnanFay is applied to another tech!
P.S. LOL settings Weapons to ZERO … not so good for the attacker!
This is now how the game works!
I should say, this is how Triton works. You cant lock Proteus techs right now and I’ve got a task to rethink experimentation and spying.
Thanks Jay for making this change. I just tested in a quick game against the Robots with all but two techs locked. Ran it through 15 cycles before deleting - worked great as ONLY those two techs were HIT each time. For grins, I tried the corner case where ALL techs were locked … and as expected, NOTHING gets done.
Is this change in effect for existing games or just new ones?
Just curious if in the current 1v1 game the Dice Gods will hammer me again!
@nick.muzzio is going to LOVE this screenshot … I actually got TWO Weapons hits - talk about a Karma payback from the Dice Gods!!!
Click image to see big. In a nutshell, I spent a bunch of effort finishing (expensive) Exp2 just before Cycle3 ended … and got a Weapons hit (no help) for Cycle3 … and then got ANOTHER weapons hit for Cyle4. Glad to say I didn’t hit the trifecta and finally (!) got something else for Cycle5.
May/2018 1v1 EPIC Tournament - AnnanFay is the winner!
From my point of view I think it should not effect existing games and I hope it doesn’t. It messes up choices made during the tournament.
From my point of view:
- 2015 This thread requesting Exp is changed
- 2018 Tournament round 2 starts
- HULK invests in Exp. (a risky gamble with high reward potential)
- HULK gets unlucky and goes from being against changing Exp to wanting it changed.
- Exp mechanics are change mid-tournament game.
IHG on Discord:
I just pushed another change update. That feature that Hulk wanted where EXP doest hit locked tech.
Now, I don’t think HULK or Jay meant it to look like this or that there are any bad intentions. And I think HULK will probably agree that it should not effect current games. It just looks bad when laid out as above.
As far as I know there’s no way of limiting changes to new games only. Jay mentioned on Discord one of the reasons Proteus is still in beta is that he doesn’t want to apply the Espionage fixes (whatever they are) to live non-beta games as this would be overly disruptive.
Oh crap - that’s a valid point that completely escaped me and yea, I can see where it might “look bad”
Thanks for pointing out @AnnanFay.
I honestly thought the whole thing was comedy - since I was the one saying maybe not such a big deal that “sometimes the scientists screw up!” … and then Dice Gods hit me HARD with TWO (useless) Weapons hit early in the game (Cycle 3 & 4) … so basically I got hosed about as bad as possible.
Going forward, I think Jay’s change is the “right” thing to do (even more so for 1v1 games), but to address the specific game I’m currently in with @AnnanFay, here are a couple of options:
Continue to play as-is with updated exp behavior. I currently have Exp2 (versus his Exp1) so while I already got hammered hard twice by no EXP points, there is a benefit to me going forward as I won’t get a (useless) Weapons hit.
Jay can modify the NP code so ONLY our game (link here) uses the old behavior.
I.e. 1 out of 7 chance Weapons comes up … for both of us!
But this is imposing on Jay, so I’m reluctant to ask him to hack up the code … and then have to remove it.
We can start a new game. Two of the four quarterfinal games have completed and the third one looks like it could be decided soon, so while I’m reluctant to hold up the overall tournament, I want to do what is fair.
Any other options?
What’s your preference @AnnanFay?
Sorry Guys, I thought you had finished that round of the tournament.
I will roll back the change until you tell me you guys are done.
Jay: Thanks for the rollback and will let you know when we finish this round of games … and give you time to roll the code change back in before I setup the semi-final games.
@AnnanFay - thanks again for pointing this out … but HEY, I’m hoping you get a bunch of Weapons hits with your Exp1 while I get some juicy stuff with my Exp2!
Speaking of which, I just made my moves and submitted, so hit your SUBMIT button and lets see what we get at the end of Cycle6 …
FYI Jay that I just conceded defeat in my game with @AnnanFay … so if you can please roll the “Exp does not hit locked technology” patch back into NP and let me know when that is done, I’ll set up the semi-final games.
FYI that I heard back from Jay (and also confirmed with a test game) that Experimentation will no longer hit a locked technology.